Brent Nyitray
Fairlington Blade
Let the mutherfuker burn!
jnc4p
Kevin S. Willis
Michigoose
lmsinca
markinaustin
Arcanaut
novahockey
quarterback
ScottC
yellojktThe intellectual difference as to how men and women frame their personal narratives.
Can men and women just be friends?
The men answer no, but leave out the obvious answer: “Well, sure, if she’s not attractive.” 😉
I love the fact that, after listening to all these women say that men and women can be “just friends”, he asks the follow up question: “So, do you think he would hook up with you, if you gave him a chance?”
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All the pictures you could ever want to permanently crush any hope you might have ever held for the future of humanity.
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All Things in Moderation 
The question of age presents itself, doesn't it? Most men I know have had long friendships with some women. They may have had romantic interludes with women they count as friends – this does not seem in any way mutually exclusive to most adults, afaik. OTOH, teenage guys – even some guys in their early twenties – have difficulty relating to women on a non-sexual level. I recall when my oldest daughter, at 14, asked me how she could tell if a guy was telling the truth when he said he loved her. I said adolescent boys are often telling the truth when they say it, but they have no idea what they are talking about. Being overwhelmed by hormonal response feels just like what we are told love feels like, but love is really only about wanting the other person to be all she can be in her own lights. Love has to do with trust and friendship, and sex has to do with hormones. Nice to get both in one package, but until she was 25 or so she shouldn't expect any guy not to be confused. I take the guys in the video at their word – they are confused. A good personal test for them would be to ask themselves whether they would like to hang out with the chick if she were a guy – would she be fun just to hang with, based on shared likes other than sex. These guys are just now old enough to dimly get it. But they could, for the rest of their lives, also truly be friends with women whom they would feel lucky to have got lucky. That, it seems to me, is not a problem.
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If only you had posted thosehotos while my wife was pregnant, we could have found some inspiration like the slam dunk picture.
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I've been with the same woman since I was seventeen. In those thirty years I have had a lot of woman friends, many of whom were attractive but I have never been tempted to act on it. I don't know if I'd behave differently if I were available.
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This feels like a truth or dare thread. I've either had a boyfriend or been married since I was 15, but I've always had guy friends. I had my skiing buddies, surfing buddies, pool hall buddies and drinking buddies (that was all a long time ago though). I never really knew if they were interested in more, and didn't ask, but I've always been more comfortable with guys than girls. It's probably because I was a bit of a tom boy, who knows? My girls are all the same way, we're not girly girls, but there's never a shortage of guys hanging around.
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Yeah, I think I'm going to just leave this one alone. I have a definite opinion. ; )
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Here's a little bit more re the regulatory arm of the CME which had oversight of MF Global. I realize no one thought much of the piece I linked yesterday but part of it that I found interesting was the trust issue.WASHINGTON (Reuters) – The regulatory arm of CME Group has turned over interviews to the Justice Department that allege former MF Global chief Jon Corzine knew that the now-bankrupt brokerage firm used customer money to lend to a European affiliate, a CME executive said on Tuesday.The information is fourth-hand but is the strongest statement yet from a regulator that Corzine may have personally known customer funds were diverted for firm use. CME Executive Chairman Terrence Duffy, testifying to the Senate Agriculture Committee, on Tuesday said a CME auditor participated in a phone call during which an MF Global employee indicated that Corzine knew of the loan.During an internal CME interview, the auditor also revealed that the loan was for roughly $175 million to a European affiliate of MF Global and was likely made in the last couple of days prior to the firm's October 31 bankruptcy, Duffy said.The CME is a front-line regulator for MF Global."A CME auditor … participated in a phone call with senior MF Global employees wherein one employee indicated that Mr. Corzine knew about the loans that had been made from the customer segregated accounts," Duffy said. Farmers who became collateral damage from the collapse of MF Global got a chance to air their frustrations, telling lawmakers that their confidence in the markets has been shaken.Dean Tofteland, a corn and soybean farmer from Minnesota, said when he heard news that MF Global was having problems, he talked to his broker, who told him, "No customer has ever lost a penny in customer segregated accounts."But three days later his $253,000 account was frozen and he could not adjust his short positions.Tofteland's positions were transferred to a new broker with only 15 percent of the required collateral, and he was forced to liquidate the hedges, he said. Since then, prices dropped and he lost another $100,000 without having the hedge.Tofteland said he has not returned to the futures market."What they call 'unlawful comingling' on Wall Street is called 'stealing' back on Main Street," he told lawmakers.
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Really depends on what one means by "just friends"–even the girls know their guy friends would fool around with them, if they gave them the green light. Does it mean never feeling any sense of sexual subtext? In any case, hormone levels have a lot to do with it. I suspect 98% of guys think of attractive female friends in a sexual way pretty consistently, when they are young and are a position of experiencing a young man's libido. Hormones!The older you are, the more likely it is that you'd get guys answering "yes" to the "can men and women just be friends" question. In fact, you'll run into a few guys who wouldn't want anything more. Sexual relationships lead to emotional entanglements (and lots of extra expenses) and all that's a lot of damned work.
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The video was rather enlightening, and I wish I had seen it a couple of decades ago. Wouldn't have changed my behavior any though.I have to grin; I am such a bundle of contradictions! Make no mistake, I like men, and I like sex, but not with women whatever at all no no no. And forming friendships with other women is really hard for me; no idea as to why. Most of my friends are guys.However.In my late 20's and early 30's, I was so tired of 'the scene', and wanted nothing soever to do with it. It was so bad, I would tell a guy that if he was expecting sex, he could just leave now. Not one of them ever respected that.In my late 30's, if we couldn't go out in a group, don't ask me. Don't want a date. I don't know you!Today, in mid 40's, I just flat out don't trust men. Yes, you read correctly, all of my friends but one are guys. Mark, what you told your daughter is awesome. Unfortunately, communications in my house weren't that open. I would really rather have died before asking either of my parents anything to do with dating, or boys.Kevin, gosh durn it, you ripped off my rose-colored sunglasses. Caused me to go back and recall, and as I recall, only one guy has never made the attempt. (co-workers don't count).Grrrr!
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I wanted to comment at PL this morning but could not do so b/c of limitations at the WaPo, I think. Just in order to get it off my chest, my comment would have read as follows:Host wrote:"If Gingrich debated his way past Romney and everyone else, why couldn’t he do the same to Obama?"In fact, my R friends and colleagues are certain NLG will outshine BHO in debate or in forum.When I suggest that NLG has an unfair advantage in that no fact checker bleeps him as he speaks, some of them are not even offended on NLG's behalf. To be fair, others actually think that if a fact check bleeper were allowed, all we would ever hear are articles and pronouns, from any candidate.Host asks a rhetorical question about the NY Post. NYC is reliably liberal and any poll results there that skew moderate or conservative are newsworthy. That New Yorkers polled as liberals I would not think was worth more than a passing mention here at the PL. There are reasons to be snide about the quality or qualities of the NY Post. That it might not feature a poll of liberals polling liberal is well down the list.
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Most people don't vote debate results. And I think that you are selling Obama short on the debate field.My dad was a staunch republican, but his response to Newt, back in the day, was a rather rude snort. He would respond much more rudely than that if he were still around today.
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Taroya, thanx for the vote of confidence in my single fathering of a teenage daughter.I think BHO will acquit himself well. The context was Sargent's "surprise" that Rs think NLG will be a strong debater. He thought it had something to do with NLG besting WMR. My R friends [one of whom, like your dad, never much cared for NLG] were convinced NLG could do perform in a talk contest with anyone a long time ago.
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I am not certain that Newt would be perceived to outshine BO in a debate. It's a little like a football game. It has to be played.But I have absolutely no question that Newt would mop the floor with BO in substance, because that is just the nature of factual reality. And I have a good degree of confidence that Newt would never back down from BO's bluster as the paper tiger debater he is. BO is all style and no substance.With respect to fact checking, some of us would like someone's finger on the button whenever BO opens his mouth.
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Guess I'm going to jump into the deep end with this comment …yello:I have had a lot of woman friends, many of whom were attractive but I have never been tempted to act on it. I don't know if I'd behave differently if I were available. Some of us have empirical evidence about how we behave with attractive single friends when we're available versus when we're not. Um, just sayin'.Taroya:Caused me to go back and recall, and as I recall, only one guy has never made the attempt.That means you must be smoking hot. 🙂
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Mike: oh, please, spare me. I have a hook nose, no lips, and only a couple of bumps on the washboard.As for that one guy (I have to laugh, uproariously!), I made a pass at him. Turned me down cold! Smokin' hot, not even on the cool side of warm…FYI: I don't recognize you, so I want to say that here in ATiM, I am rarely offended, and rarely attack. I really do enjoy the conversations, whether I agree or not. Sometimes more when I don't agree.Yello: Wanna hang out a while?
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Taroya, how's the job search going?One oddity I've found in the male/female friendship deal is that most guys actually do a little better having friends who are girls if they're unattached. Usually their better half steers them away from the single female friends. At least that's been our observation around here.
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My regular recruiter should be calling in about 30 minutes with a possibility. But I swear to god if they only pay $18-$20 an hour, it will be all that I can do to keep from losing my temper. I have had several cold calls like that. What an insult! Echoes of the Rant, why is it I am supposed to read up on them, but they don't feel they should pay attention?Yeah, some of the issues were from better halves, and I get that. Mostly though, I just don't know very many women that love to play pool, and are competitive about it, or are into IT and other such technical endeavors. OTOH, I don't go gaga over babies or clothes shopping, so I guess it is about equal.It still upsets me though. I would like to have more female friends. Surely I am not THAT different?
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" I have absolutely no question that Newt would mop the floor with BO in substance, because that is just the nature of factual reality."LOL. That is the nature of biased perception, which is different from factual reality. For instance – the Newt has criticized Romney for making profits by bankrupting companies. You criticized similar statements recently when they were made by non conservatives. Has your mind changed now that The Newt endorses that reality?
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" , I just don't know very many women that love to play pool, and are competitive about it, or are into IT and other such technical endeavors. OTOH, I don't go gaga over babies or clothes shopping, so I guess it is about equal."I feel your pain. As a guy who's not into sports, my situation is similar. Like lms notes, I had more female friends when I was single than male. Oddly most of my male friends now are people I've met through my wife.
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bsimon: Wanna hang a while?
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I must also relate: I didn't know for some time what the new meaning of 'hook up' was. I was under the impression that it was, for real, just friends going somewhere.
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"You criticized similar statements recently when they were made by non conservatives. Has your mind changed now that The Newt endorses that reality?"I think it was a ridiculous and demogogic statement, if that is how he intended it. It is also possible that his intention was merely to show how Romney's characterization of his own earnings was ridiculous.
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Taroya – come on out to msp. I haven't shot pool in a while. Might even have some IT leads for you.Qb- it was a retort to the suggestion that The Newt should return income from consulting for Frannie/Freddie. Clever, quick-witted and somewhat petty.
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Taroya:Smokin' hot, not even on the cool side of warm…Clearly some guys out there disagree with your self-assessment.I try not to offend, but sometimes need a slap upside the head when I do. Call me out when you think it's needed — so "all will be right with the world."
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Taroya: I must also relate: I didn't know for some time what the new meaning of 'hook up' was. I was under the impression that it was, for real, just friends going somewhere.It is friends going somewhere. And then doing some hanky-panky. I have also never been into sports. Remotely. Always been into computers and genre fiction, so I fit the archetype of the typical male geek. Usually their better half steers them away from the single female friends. Or makes it a pain in the ass to have 'em. Fair enough. Only so many hours in a day, best to spend them with the family.
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"Qb- it was a retort to the suggestion that The Newt should return income from consulting for Frannie/Freddie. Clever, quick-witted and somewhat petty."I know what it was and to what it responded. I found it neither clever nor quick witted. I found it petty or worse, as I did the attack on Newt.
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Yeah, I have only ever had female friends when I was single. Maybe I should have dated more secure women. My wife was the jealous type, but she was largely justified given that her father left her mom for his secretary. She has dropped all that as I have proven myself to be trustworthy. I probably need to start paying more attention to NLG given his rise in the polls, possibly it's just his turn right now, but my MIL (mother in law) is a pretty big R and doesn't think he is electable given his demeanor, marital past and some of the crazy things he has said in the past. He's seems smart to me, so he's probably doomed.
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" I found it neither clever nor quick witted. I found it petty or worse, as I did the attack on Newt."Reasonable, if somewhat surprising given the argument that The Newt is a fact-based candidate, while BHO is all style & no substance.
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Yeah, that jealousy thing can work both ways though. I had a great friend for many years who shared the same birthday. We always used to celebrate together until I met my husband. We'd only been dating about 4 months when my birthday rolled around and we went out but when he brought me home there were flowers at my front door, not from him either. He was not too happy……lol
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Lol….that's classic lmsinca. You never want someone to get your wife something better than you or treat her better than you on her birthday. And thanks for the "push gift" suggestions from everyone who contributed a while back. I got my wife some earrings with my son's birthstone and she hasn't taken them out yet.
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Most of my friends over the years have been guys, probably because I like sports more than babies and/or clothes (with the exception of boots) :-)My ex's best friends both in school and at work were women who became friends of mine. I'm not much of a girly girl, either, which makes it hard for me to relate to many of my girl friends.
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MichiI'm not much of a girly girl, eitherThat must be why we get along so well. Except I do like babies a lot. But I grew up in sports of every kind imaginable. I even played field hockey in high school……lolashotHow are baby and mom doing?
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The age thing, one more time:At 15-but-nearly 16, I recall raving to my uncle, a cop, about the virtues I had invested in my then girlfriend. He interrupted me to ask "Does she have a good heart?" I apparently explained to him that she was a cheerleader, so her heart and lungs must be in pretty good shape.Yes, my uncle repeated that conversation back to me until I was old enough to understand what an idiot I was at 15-almost-16.
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Mark:Reminds me of the old joke….when I was 15 I couldn't believe how little my father knew about life. And by the time I was 25, I was amazed at how much he had learned in just 10 years.
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lms:That must be why we get along so well.I wonder if it has something to do with why you like to hang out on political blogs. Seriously, I think there may be something to that. Have you ever known a "girly-girl" who likes to spout off about politics to a bunch strangers on the internet?
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Scott, what about Tena………………just kidding. I never thought about it but there might be something to it, or maybe I'm just avoiding house work.
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Interesting point, Scott (the bit about political blogs). We'd have to poll the other women here, although I think we already know that taroya isn't a "girly girl" either.okie? MsJS?
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or maybe I'm just avoiding house work.Excellent idea!!
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lms:Scott, what about TenaTena was definitely not a frakkin' girly-girl!
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Have you ever known a "girly-girl" who likes to spout off about politics to a bunch strangers on the internet?I don't think that I have. Not that I can think of, anyway. Look at some of the most well-known political pundits. Ann Coulter is a firebrand, but she's not a girly-girl. She even wrote an essay on dating once–she definitely does not come across as girly.
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You never want someone to get your wife something better than you or treat her better than you on her birthday.I dunno. My experience is, spouses grade on a scale. One little "just right" think from somebody else can trump all your birthday planning and expense. Of course, you were supposed to buy her a diamond-encrusted Ferrari paid for by selling your kidneys (both of 'em). She's your wife. But the co-worker who bought her a Chia Pet? How did she even know that she used to like Chia Pets? How thoughtful. Why can't you ever be that thoughtful? It doesn't help to point out that she would have gone batshit crazy if you had bought her the Chia pet. As a tangent, here is how you identify someone who is extremely difficult to shop for: they will tell you they are easy to shop for. Red. Flag.
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I always just ask for books…………anything beyond that is a bonus. My husband quit buying me jewelry because I almost never wear it. After losing two sapphires and a diamond out of my wedding ring, an opal, and getting another ring crushed between a bench and a wall, I'm a lost cause. I keep reminding him though that it was his idea to put me to work in a freakin' warehouse.
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lmsinca-Mom and baby are both doing well. He actually sleeps pretty well at night with the odd night here and there where he doesn't. Last night he slept for 4 hours then for 3 hours and he was asleep when I left for work this morning. So was my wife.My wife is also not a jewelry girl which is odd because generally she is a girly girl. She only wears the earrings and rings I have bought her so that's all she'll be getting in the jewelry department in the future.
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